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Senator
Ahmed Mohammed Makarfi was governor of Kaduna State, North West Nigeria, for
eight years. In the early days of his first term, the state was rocked by
violent ethno-religious conflicts in which more than three thousand people were
killed and hundreds of millions of naira worth of property destroyed. Remarkably,
he stood firm, in spite of ill health, and restored relative peace, order and
stability to the state. His administration’s successful management of the
ethnic and religious diversity of the state is worth understudying especially
considering the increasing ethno-religious division in our politics and the
security challenges confronting some parts of Nigeria. The QreatifDave Blog had
a chat with the amiable senator at the weekend. Below are excerpts of the chat.
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Q:
You were for eight years the governor of one of the most cosmopolitan,
ethnically and religiously diverse states in Nigeria. How did you manage this
diversity?
A:
I came into office with a fair knowledge of our state having been a public
officer (Commissioner of Finance and Planning for three years [in the military
administration of Col. Lawal Jafaru Isa]) which enabled me to interact with all
our people and traverse the length and breath of our state, thereby enriching
my knowledge of the needs of our people. That helped me a lot, because I didn’t
just find myself in a position of authority without some kind of idea of the
task before me [which] included conflict management issues. We [in the Col.
Jafaru Isa administration] encountered the Zangon Kataf issue not yet resolved,
and the then military administrator, did a lot; we all actively participated in
reaching a lasting solution to a number of contentious issues.
So
with that background, and with my training right from primary to secondary
school, (I did my secondary school in Enugu) I associated with a variety of
people from across Nigeria. With that background, I knew that one has to run a
purposeful leadership. Purposeful in the sense of that that leadership should,
as much as possible, be meeting the needs of the people. One should run an open
government where people could have access to him/her. Also, one has to be an
unbiased leader and be guided by the principles of equity, justice and fairness
to all.
These
were our guiding principles in governance; [this was] what helped us
tremendously in getting to where we got.
Q: What were the measures you
undertook to facilitate the reduction of violent conflicts during your term as
governor of Kaduna State?
A:
First of all, access to government. You see, when the people you are leading
cannot have access to you, they resort to violence to vent their anger. But
when they know they have access to you, and are able to relate to you anything
they don’t understand or things that touches them and they are sure of being heard
one way or the other, they rush to you. When your doors are open, they are able
to tell you what their issues are; if it is an issue that requires your
explanation, you explain, they understand. They explain some issues to you so
that you will understand their position and take relevant measures. When their
issues require reconciliation, you call both parties and reconcile them. [Free
access to government] was an effective measure [for my administration].
Secondly,
every week we used to receive courtesy calls from communities coming to tell us
their problems, needs and desires. And that formed the basis of the annual
budgets that we used to make.
By
and large, hardly will a community come without having a number of their needs
or demands met within a reasonable period of time. If people are getting this,
they will listen and respect the authority.
If you say, “don’t do this,” they will listen to you; if you say, “do
this,” they will listen to you, because you are also listening to them. Not just
listening, but making efforts to meet their needs. Above all, we solved the
issue of the age-old, some of them century-old, quest for traditional
institutions for independence, so to say, [for some communities in the Kaduna State].
Even
though the administration under which I served (that of Col. Lawal Jafaru Isa)
started addressing this, it was not a comprehensive address of the issue. We
basically comprehensively addressed that. Some people never ever thought it was
going to be possible, even if possible, not as comprehensive as that. That also
earned us a lot of confidence.
Third:
we were religiously and ethnically unbiased in our programmes and actions.
Q:
Drawing from your experience in managing ethno-religious conflicts in Kaduna
State (which is a microcosm of Nigeria) what lessons can you share with the
rest of Nigeria that you believe can be scaled up to address the current
security challenges in the country?
A:
If you refer to my last answer, that is exactly the measures that I believe our
leaders, especially those in places that are multi-ethnic or multi-religious, must
imbibe. They must be leaders for all, not for one and not the other. They must
be accessible to the people that they lead. They must be promise keepers not
promise breakers. They should behave more humane; it is not like a
master-servant relationship. And they should not run away from addressing the
problem. Problems should be addressed no matter whose ox is gored. And if you
play around with the problem, it’s like a small spark that can consume the
entire community or even an entire state. This is the lessons our current and
future leaders should imbibe.
Q:
If you look at the map of the votes cast in the last general elections (2011
elections) you will see a clear line depicting the ethnic and religious
divisiveness in Nigeria. It seems like
from the advent of the current administration, religion and ethnicity is
increasing playing a prominent role in our politics. Does this bode well for
our democracy and the corporate existence of the nation?
A:
Honestly speaking, it is not a good omen. But again, it’s a problem of the elites.
It is not the problem of the led. The problem is not that bad because the led
are the majority. They should just awaken from their slumber and not allow
those of us that are the elite to mislead them purely with a view to continue
to exercise political authority over them or acquire political authority over
them.
Q:
Are you saying this artificial division is created by….
A:
It is not artificial; it is real. But essentially, who are the beneficiaries?
What is the difference between problems of the village man you find in the South-South
and the one in the North? They are basically the same. But leaders come to tell
them that look, “they are cheating us, they are doing this, they are doing
that.” And they innocently follow.
Q:
So, what can the people of Nigeria do about this…?
A:
People should know that they must stop allowing themselves to be used. Anybody
that comes to them, ask the person what he has done to better your life with
what he has not what he will have.
Q:
Your senatorial constituency has a large ethnic and religious minorities
especially in Lere LGA, some of whom have voiced concerns about their exclusion
from benefiting from your representing them in the Senate. Can you address
these concerns?
A:
I have to know what kind of benefit senators give…
Q:
One doctor said senators; members of the House of Representatives and House of
Assembly members sometimes get the privilege of getting slots for appointments,
jobs or scholarships….
A:
All these things are handled by the Local Government; I don’t handle it myself.
Whatever I have is equally shared to the eight Local Government Areas I
represent. So if they have a local problem with their Local Government, it
cannot be ascribed to me. If you talk of scholarships; I don’t handle them. The
numbers that are given are sent to the Local Government. Anything I do is
equally shared to the Local Governments.
Q:
Kaduna State witnessed relatively equitable infrastructural and rural
development during your tenure as governor of the state. What did you do to
facilitate this, considering the limited resources available to the state at
the time?
A:
Well, in a way, we have also answered this in the previous questions. If when I
was governor, the resources we had were fairly and equitably shared to the
whole of our people, so what will happen differently now that I am in the Senate?
Absolutely nothing. But then, the position of governor and senator are
different. So you don’t expect the same thing from one that was a governor when
he becomes a senator.
Now
all I can say is that we are conscious of our responsibilities; and we try to
govern fairly, equitably with the fear of God knowing that we will end up being
accountable to Him.
Q:
When you were governor we use to hear that by virtue of your training as an accountant,
you were very scrupulous about expenditure and that expenditure that went
beyond a certain figure, you have to vet and approve; could that be…
A:
I wasn’t vetting. There was a committee to do the vetting. There was a
technical committee looking at prices and other things so that there is a
standard. Not only standards, but such that value for money can be gotten for
any public fund spent.
Q:
Recently, the President inaugurated a committee to work out the modalities for
the convening of a national conference. What are your thoughts on this proposed
National Conference?
A:
It’s good. We are in a democracy. There is nothing harmful in talking. But as I’ve
said before, based on experience and the fact that government have said that [the
outcome of the conference] will be subject to legislative action by the National
Assembly, maybe the best conference we need that can be effective, is a conference
of those who have the power to bring about change. Of course with also an infusion
of some interest groups and nationally recognized important NGOs and other
bodies. So that the people with the power can really understand what the people
expect from the led. If issues are unanimously agreed upon in such a conference,
then no one will go back and act differently. If the National Assembly is
there, then they will not go back and act differently. If the State Assemblies
are there, they will not go back and act differently. If the Presidency is
there, the governors are there, the Local Governments are there…. So the conference
of those who have the authority to bring about change. Based on past
experience, we should try to define the kind of conference that will be best
for Nigeria, not just a talk shop.
Q:
What is your vision for Nigeria?
A: Honestly
speaking, I can only talk in general terms, that is I envisage a country that will be a secured, united, prosperous and equitable country. That is my vision for Nigeria.
